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Offline Paullie

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #20 on: 13 November, 2018, 01:22:40 AM »
A sad story! My commiserations. And it's worth reminding other people that, when you jump start from another vehicle they must NOT have their engine running! (maybe you knew this already - seems the AA man did). Jump from a car or truck with their engine running and there's a good chance it will fry your reg/rect.  :003:   

Though with your use as a daily commuter, yours might have been on the way out already, unfortunately.

Online Yellow Dog

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #21 on: 13 November, 2018, 05:20:21 AM »
*Originally Posted by Paullie [+]
Ha, you switched to lock with lights! ....  :157:  Well, new batt would be a good investment anyway .....

It's just so hard to explain 6v, in a way anyone would believe, for such a regularly ridden bike.

But you did it perfectly  :152:
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Offline Tigermike

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #22 on: 13 November, 2018, 01:01:53 PM »
*Originally Posted by Paullie [+]
A sad story! My commiserations. And it's worth reminding other people that, when you jump start from another vehicle they must NOT have their engine running! (maybe you knew this already - seems the AA man did). Jump from a car or truck with their engine running and there's a good chance it will fry your reg/rect.  :003:   

Though with your use as a daily commuter, yours might have been on the way out already, unfortunately.
Cheers Paullie, & oops yes his land rover was running when i started the bike  :157:
after talking to Bruce at Hughenden M40 his recommendation was to replace the Reg/Rec so have ordered an Electrex one from WeMoto for 120 delivered to work tomorrow.
so have Thursday holiday to fit it & fingers crossed its deffo the cause.  :084:
Yam RD125 DX, Kwak GPZ305, Honda CB400T, 1983 Kwak GT550, Suzuki GSF650 Bandit, Tiger 1050SE .... got there in the end.

Offline ZuluTiger

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #23 on: 13 November, 2018, 08:21:29 PM »
I think there are some crossed wires here based on my understanding and experience of failures. The reason for running / not running the vehicle which is the source for the jump, is being misinterpreted, IMHO. Typically the 'load' battery is dead or low. If you do not run the source vehicle engine, you run the risk of flattening it if the load is a big one like another car, truck etc. Then you have two stranded vehicles. So, you should run the source vehicle, but now you have to be smart:

When you connect to the flat battery of the 'load', the source regulator goes into boost mode as the load draws current and lowers voltage. Unclipping the source leads has no effect on the 'load' regulator as it is driving current into the low battery, as designed. The damage that occurs is at the Good Samaritan's end. When you lift the jumper lead with the engine running, the SOURCE regulator is boosting and suffers a massive spike due to the sudden removal of the load. This then damages the SOURCE diode pack and regulator. The 'load' is already disconnected so does not get the spike. So, if the OP's bike has a broken regulator, it is unlikely it was caused by the jump. If the Landrover suffers a failed regulator in the next few weeks, we'll know who to blame  :005:

This is why it is recommended to switch on the SOURCE vehicle's lights, etc. before disconnecting the 'load'. It provides a sink for the boosted voltage (a load, in other words) and helps protect the source vehicle. Which is what I mentioned in the earlier post ...   
When folks ask me how I am, I reply "I'm here". Seems odd until you consider the alternative...

Offline seangee

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #24 on: 13 November, 2018, 08:37:04 PM »
*Originally Posted by Tigermike [+]
just found myself in a similar predicament, fitted a 14 series Yuasa about 4 weeks ago - all has been good until this evening,
left work at 5 went to start the bike and it was only turning over  briefly before dying   :232:
luckily my mate was still at work so after an attempt to bump it, he drove to the local garage for a set of jump leads,
started straight away from his landrover  :152:
so got off up the M40 to home, got to junction 10 came off the slip road and was just getting to the roundabout when all the lights and engine just died  :232: luckily i wasnt half way round the roundabout with a HGV up me butt  :125:
called AA man who arrived about  8.10pm, bike started 1st time when he put his portable battery on but my battery was only reading 12.6V & was slowly reducing as it was running - got down to 10.8V  :005:
Charging circuit ?? Alternator gone ?
so put bike on the trailer & eventually got home at about half 9, tired, cold, hungry & thoroughly piddled off  :183:


so have got the cage for the next 2 days & will order a new alternator & gasket & hopefully install it thursday if i can get it quickly.


Recon your R/R was already on its way. When it was brand new I left my sprint for a day with the park lights on. Dead as a dodo. Luckily the parking garage had a power pack (I was on the basement level). Rode it home and replaced the battery about 3 years later. Only left them on once since. That time they were glowing brightly when I got to my bike. Put the key in and started first time. I just googled T10 LED and picked a random one on the list. No idea what brand but transferred them to the Tiger when I swapped bikes and they still doing the job.
Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool.

Offline Tigermike

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #25 on: 13 November, 2018, 09:49:15 PM »
*Originally Posted by ZuluTiger [+]
So, if the OP's bike has a broken regulator, it is unlikely it was caused by the jump. If the Landrover suffers a failed regulator in the next few weeks, we'll know who to blame  :005:

This is why it is recommended to switch on the SOURCE vehicle's lights, etc. before disconnecting the 'load'. It provides a sink for the boosted voltage (a load, in other words) and helps protect the source vehicle. Which is what I mentioned in the earlier post ...

thanks ZT, my mate had his lights on while connected so hopefully his Land rover will be ok.

Yes Sean, you and Paullie are probably right that the r\r has been on its way out for a while, my previous battery a motobatt , is probably still ok so despite being on charge overnight it would have given me more than 3 starts the next day if the r\r had been 100%.
 :031: to you all.
Yam RD125 DX, Kwak GPZ305, Honda CB400T, 1983 Kwak GT550, Suzuki GSF650 Bandit, Tiger 1050SE .... got there in the end.

Online Yellow Dog

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #26 on: 13 November, 2018, 10:40:39 PM »
Yes ZT and understood. The lights on precaution is a good one. I understand that you can but specially adapted jump leads, to protect the regulator from such surges.

I was told that with many modern cars now, once the other vehicle starts, it then pumps additional volts back to the donor and that is why the donor vehicle should not be running, at the time of disconnection. It's the electronic management system being unable to cope with the addition current that is the main problem and for example, Audi NZ quote NZ$5000 (yes I know they are crooks) to address the issue and advise strongly against ever using your vehicle to help someone in this way.

 
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Offline ZuluTiger

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #27 on: 14 November, 2018, 11:03:53 AM »
I agree with everyone, as this is not a simple issue. Old incandescent lights (with a high wattage) were a great load to help the source vehicle but new LED's are probably way less effective as a sink. It's all about knowing what gives and acting accordingly. 
When folks ask me how I am, I reply "I'm here". Seems odd until you consider the alternative...

Offline Tigermike

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #28 on: 15 November, 2018, 05:35:31 PM »
*Originally Posted by Tigermike [+]

thanks ZT, my mate had his lights on while connected so hopefully his Land rover will be ok.

Yes Sean, you and Paullie are probably right that the r\r has been on its way out for a while, my previous battery a motobatt , is probably still ok so despite being on charge overnight it would have given me more than 3 starts the next day if the r\r had been 100%.
 :031: to you all.
Well, you (and me) are all wrong including the mechanic at Hugheneden M40.. got the Reg/Rec fitted this morning.
Battery was reading 13.4 V after being on the Optimate last 3 nights, started bike  - now reading 12.4Va at idle, 12.25V with grips & LED lights on  :187:   :019:
so back on the phone to Wemoto for a new Stator - another 120  :138:
the day wasnt a complete failure as i gave the bike an oil & filter change with that fully synthetic Shell oil i bought a week or so ago & i fitted the set of uprated heavy duty battery cables as well  :046:
Yam RD125 DX, Kwak GPZ305, Honda CB400T, 1983 Kwak GT550, Suzuki GSF650 Bandit, Tiger 1050SE .... got there in the end.

Offline Tigermike

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Re: Should it... could it...
« Reply #29 on: 15 November, 2018, 05:43:42 PM »
wish i had of watched this Monday night, i wouldnt have bought the wrong bluddy thing  :232:
Yam RD125 DX, Kwak GPZ305, Honda CB400T, 1983 Kwak GT550, Suzuki GSF650 Bandit, Tiger 1050SE .... got there in the end.