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Offline Biccys

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #170 on: 09 January, 2019, 11:35:22 AM »
*Originally Posted by Mike_B [+]
^^^ what gosling1 says  ^^^

The early TS runs a different ECU from pre-Sport bikes which requires different maps.   I have an aftermarket SC Project can on mine (with baffle in) and am running the 20715 tune (according to DealerTool, which can tell me that much but cant load new tunes in).   Its what a Triumph dealer would call the Arrow Road tune, as its intended for bikes with the factory Arrow cans.

No snatching on mine and averaging 46mpg on my 35 mile mixed road commute.  Sounds like it would be worth a try on yours, if you havent yet:

I believe that was what was in mine from stock. I'll certainly give it a go though. The snatchiness wasn't huge, just more noticeable than my old 800. I guess I was not quite used to the extra HP maybe? I have a copy of Dave's tune based on 20715 so I'll try that first and I'll get back to ya!

Thanks all.

Offline indytiger1050

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #171 on: 09 January, 2019, 11:37:51 PM »
*Originally Posted by Biccys [+]
Apologies for the repeat post (I posted this in the list of tunes thread too, but this seems like a more appropriate thread!)
I've been tinkering with the map on my 2014 TS. It is completely stock AFAIK save for the Scorpion can which has the baffle out.
The original tune was as advertised everywhere, snatchy at low revs and lumpy both hot and cold. I tried to map Dave73's stock v2 but TuneECU reported it wasn't compatible with my bike. Is that correct!? I have since flashed the TS Frankentune map and while it removes the snatchiness all over, MPG has plummeted from 45-46 down to about 36-37 which isn't sustainable.
Is there a tune that's a compromise?! Indy, yours is getting a lot of praise here, and I like the idea of no stalling and higher top end with the mid range grunt it already has. Will this be the compromise I'm after?!
Maybe.

How's that for an answer.   

TO make this as short as possible.   THE Man says engines have to produce X nasty's. (emissions) 
SO to manage this the companies do whatever it takes to manage those numbers.  In most cases this is running the engine leaner than it should be.
Getting the best performance normally means reduced MPG. PERIOD.

But what seems to happen, is the engine runs great. WE enjoy this extra performance and twist the wrist more than before.
So you have two things happening, one is the actual loss of a little MPG from fixing the ECO tuning and the biggest is the loss of MPG from the fun factor.
I know of NO tunes that improve performance that doesn't hurt MPG a little.

Now getting real, there are many cars that offer better MPG than our bike even running the stock ECO tune. 
So if your wanting the most MPG per money spent sell the bike.

I am happy when I get 40 MPG, think the most I ever got after the tune was 46. Worst was about 30 (but I was  having a blast)

Support the forum.   :031:

Offline Biccys

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #172 on: 14 January, 2019, 02:57:39 PM »
*Originally Posted by indytiger1050 [+]
Maybe.

How's that for an answer.   

TO make this as short as possible.   THE Man says engines have to produce X nasty's. (emissions) 
SO to manage this the companies do whatever it takes to manage those numbers.  In most cases this is running the engine leaner than it should be.
Getting the best performance normally means reduced MPG. PERIOD.

But what seems to happen, is the engine runs great. WE enjoy this extra performance and twist the wrist more than before.
So you have two things happening, one is the actual loss of a little MPG from fixing the ECO tuning and the biggest is the loss of MPG from the fun factor.
I know of NO tunes that improve performance that doesn't hurt MPG a little.

Quite probably, that all makes sense to me. My issue is and always was, it's only a relatively small engine (compared to a car) and carrying far less weight than a car (I could do with shedding a few pounds I admit, but I'm not an estate car weight. Yet...) so should be giving a decent mileage. A friend of mine has a slightly smaller engined bike that gives him 65mpg no problem and he rides similar to me.  The stock tune was difficult at low revs and felt almost dangerous in 1st gear corners. The frankentune did indeed sort that and if there was an increase in performance midrange, where I do the vast majority of my riding, I sure didn't notice any. The 36 mpg didn't justify the reduced snatchiness for me. I have installed Dave's tune and done around 100miles this weekend. I noticed a little bit of lag in low end revs again but not as bad as stock, and I got around 41mpg hooning around a bit. That'll do for me. I'm reasonably happy with that as a compromise.

*Originally Posted by indytiger1050 [+]
Now getting real, there are many cars that offer better MPG than our bike even running the stock ECO tune. 
So if your wanting the most MPG per money spent sell the bike.

A bit passive aggressive. No need...

*Originally Posted by indytiger1050 [+]
I am happy when I get 40 MPG, think the most I ever got after the tune was 46. Worst was about 30 (but I was  having a blast)

I'm happy you're happy, I've no problem with increasing performance for a weekend blaster, but this is my main commuter machine for my 55 miles a day commute. I have a car that returns 50mpg on that run. Increasing my fuel bill by 40% isn't appealing!
I'm gonna run this for a few weeks and see how it gets on. Warmer weather will no doubt increase the mileage I get too so until the spring comes I'm not going to get real usage figures.

Offline Mike_B

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #173 on: 14 January, 2019, 03:35:44 PM »
It might be worth sticking the stock tune (Arrow Road one, anyway) back in and trying it again.   Like rebooting a PC.  I have a similar setup (to be exact, I have a K&N filter, SC Project low can with baffle in, and the Arrow Road tune loaded by a dealer), and no real snatching on mine.    Certainly nothing that feels noticeable.

I have experienced jerky response, but it just turned out the chain was too loose.   At low speeds and throttle openings the chain would snap tight and loose, producing a similar effect.   Def be worth a ten second look, anyway!

Offline Biccys

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #174 on: 15 January, 2019, 09:33:12 AM »
*Originally Posted by Mike_B [+]
It might be worth sticking the stock tune (Arrow Road one, anyway) back in and trying it again.   Like rebooting a PC.  I have a similar setup (to be exact, I have a K&N filter, SC Project low can with baffle in, and the Arrow Road tune loaded by a dealer), and no real snatching on mine.    Certainly nothing that feels noticeable.

I have experienced jerky response, but it just turned out the chain was too loose.   At low speeds and throttle openings the chain would snap tight and loose, producing a similar effect.   Def be worth a ten second look, anyway!

My chain is fine, there's no adjustment needed. I could try the standard Arrow tune I suppose. I'll keep on with the one I have for a few weeks and see how I get on with it but it feels better and the MPG is acceptable.

Offline Tigermike

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #175 on: 15 January, 2019, 01:04:54 PM »
*Originally Posted by Biccys [+]
My chain is fine, there's no adjustment needed. I could try the standard Arrow tune I suppose. I'll keep on with the one I have for a few weeks and see how I get on with it but it feels better and the MPG is acceptable.
I see you have a Sport but i have virtually the same setup on my 2010 SE, Airbox mod, OEM airfilter & SC project exhaust , running Daves V2 tune and am seeing 46.5 to 48.5 MPG regularly on my commute up & down the M40, was running the Arrow road tune but it had that snatchiness at low speed - IIRC i was getting 48 to 51mpg previously but the bike runs so much better with Daves V2 map.

Is the reason why your MPG is in low 40's because the map wasnt designed for the Sport  :187: just a thought!
Yam RD125 DX, Kwak GPZ305, Honda CB400T, 1983 Kwak GT550, Suzuki GSF650 Bandit, Tiger 1050SE .... got there in the end.

Offline indytiger1050

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #176 on: 15 January, 2019, 11:42:01 PM »
*Originally Posted by Biccys [+]
Quite probably, that all makes sense to me. My issue is and always was, it's only a relatively small engine (compared to a car) and carrying far less weight than a car (I could do with shedding a few pounds I admit, but I'm not an estate car weight. Yet...) so should be giving a decent mileage. A friend of mine has a slightly smaller engined bike that gives him 65mpg no problem and he rides similar to me.  The stock tune was difficult at low revs and felt almost dangerous in 1st gear corners. The frankentune did indeed sort that and if there was an increase in performance midrange, where I do the vast majority of my riding, I sure didn't notice any. The 36 mpg didn't justify the reduced snatchiness for me. I have installed Dave's tune and done around 100miles this weekend. I noticed a little bit of lag in low end revs again but not as bad as stock, and I got around 41mpg hooning around a bit. That'll do for me. I'm reasonably happy with that as a compromise.

A bit passive aggressive. No need...

I'm happy you're happy, I've no problem with increasing performance for a weekend blaster, but this is my main commuter machine for my 55 miles a day commute. I have a car that returns 50mpg on that run. Increasing my fuel bill by 40% isn't appealing!
I'm gonna run this for a few weeks and see how it gets on. Warmer weather will no doubt increase the mileage I get too so until the spring comes I'm not going to get real usage figures.

Sorry you considered that passive aggressive.

Your correct on cars getting way better MPG, my toyota corolla did. BUT the O to 60 sucked.
The HP to weight ratio, and torque per pound of our bike compared to many a sports car that give similar 0-60 or 0-120 mph then compare there MPG to ours we are doing good.

Our bike is a toy, high performance toy.

Figure  out a motorcycle that has similar HP to weight ratio to the cars your comparing to.  Then see what your MPG is .
I'm guessing 100+

SO back on topic of this tune.  MPG is not as good as stock.

Support the forum.   :031:

Offline Yellow Dog

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #177 on: 16 January, 2019, 07:25:58 PM »
*Originally Posted by indytiger1050 [+]
Sorry you considered that passive aggressive.

Your correct on cars getting way better MPG, my toyota corolla did. BUT the O to 60 sucked.
The HP to weight ratio, and torque per pound of our bike compared to many a sports car that give similar 0-60 or 0-120 mph then compare there MPG to ours we are doing good.

Our bike is a toy, high performance toy.

Figure  out a motorcycle that has similar HP to weight ratio to the cars your comparing to.  Then see what your MPG is .
I'm guessing 100+

SO back on topic of this tune.  MPG is not as good as stock.

So it seems we have two totally conflicting perspectives here.

Like IndyTiger1050 and myself, our Tigers are used roughly 95%, for pleasure purposes.

Frankly, even 20MPG wouldn't worry me, if I was getting additional enjoyment from the higher performance.

Has anyone tried measuring the performance of this tune, whilst sitting at a constant 65MPH? Just curious  :187:

Perhaps this tune needs to be labelled as a 'Fuel Drinking Recreational Tune'.

That it!  :005: It's an 'FDRT'  :152:

As a low cost option, scooters make good commuter vehicles. I've always said, one bike can't possibly do everything well  :062:   

Perhaps the 'best of both worlds'  option might be to change the tune, for weekend riding, and then change it back for commuting. It's a simple 5 minute job  :169:
« Last Edit: 16 January, 2019, 07:29:16 PM by Yellow Dog »
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Offline Hudds101

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #178 on: 23 May, 2019, 10:15:28 PM »
I downloaded Indy's Tune after doing the airbox mod, filter, decat and fitting a TOR pipe, it's definitely smoother at the bottom end and feels stronger all the way through the rev range. I do like the burble on overrun, so not bothered about blanking plate as most of my other bikes do the same. 😂 Especially the race bikes. It may be running a little rich, so I might have a play with a few other race cans I have kicking about when we get back from the TT. Also have another Tune to try out. 😊. Cheers M.

Offline Yellow Dog

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Re: 20550 Indy's tune
« Reply #179 on: 24 May, 2019, 05:19:56 PM »
*Originally Posted by Hudds101 [+]
I downloaded Indy's Tune after doing the airbox mod, filter, decat and fitting a TOR pipe, it's definitely smoother at the bottom end and feels stronger all the way through the rev range. I do like the burble on overrun, so not bothered about blanking plate as most of my other bikes do the same. 😂 Especially the race bikes. It may be running a little rich, so I might have a play with a few other race cans I have kicking about when we get back from the TT. Also have another Tune to try out. 😊. Cheers M.
Great first post. I will presume you have been a lurker for a while  :490:
The new members section might be a good starting point  :169:


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